Islamic Disuse and Twisting, Etc. of
Astronomy - Creation of the Universe
25 Nov 2012
Introduction: This part we split in different topics:
Aa: Creation of the Universe.
Ab: Describing the present Universe.
E. Earth and geology.
I. Il, al-Ilah, al-Lah, Allah.
L. Literature (we only accept central points – if not this topic becomes too wide for this “book”).
S. Science – different other topics.
1. Other themes.
(The lists start 3 “pages” down).
As for Muhammad’s ability to perform miracles, like often claimed by Islam and its Muslims, we quote from verse 17/59 in the Quran:
17/59a: And we (Allah*) refrain from sending Signs (Quran-speak for “proofs for Allah”*), only because the men of former generations treated them as false - - -“.
This is Muhammad’s standard “explanation” for why Allah would not and Muhammad himself was unable to give any real proofs for the existence of Allah or for Muhammad’s connection to a god - Allah or someone else. And it is not a good one, as it obviously is not true:
· There were stories both in the Bible and in the Quran - f.x. the sorcerers of Pharaoh Ramses II and Moses - about people believing because of the performed miracles/real proofs (if true stories).
· Muhammad knew about at least some of the stories about the miracles f.x. Jesus performed, and how huge flocks of believers he got from the miracles.
· It is not contra to, but incompatible with, human nature and psychology that not a good percentage of the ones who witnessed real miracles/proofs would not come to believe.
Muhammad was intelligent and he understood people and how to manipulate them. He knew this. But he obviously was unable to find a better excuse - there are not many excuses which would work.
What is really strange, is that Muslims have not seen through this “explanation” centuries ago, and still are unable to do so.
This is a monument over the effect of brainwashing, of wishful thinking, of ability to refuse to see the obvious, of lack of ability/training in critical thinking, of uncritical acceptance of authorities, and more. A monument over the weak point of the human mind.
There are some such cases in the Quran, the most prominent and serious may be the impossible combination of full predestination like the Quran states many places, and free will of man, and the as impossible combination of full predestination, and claims about any effect of prayers.
17/59b: “And we (Allah refrain from sending Signs (Quran-speak for “proofs for Allah”), only because the men of former generations treated them as false - - -“.
In this connection we quote Muhammad Asad: “The Message of the Quran” (a/17/71), translated from Swedish: “Several places the Quran stresses the fact that the Prophet Muhammad, in spite of being the last and greatest of Allah’s messengers, did not have the permission to make signs or miracles similar to those earlier prophets are told to have made as confirmation of their verbal preaching”.
Worth remembering each time Muslims - often believing it honestly, because their mullahs, etc. have told them so - tell you about the miracles of Muhammad or try to use claims about his miracles as arguments or proofs for something.
17/59g: “And We (Allah*) refrain from sending the Signs (real proofs*) only because the men of former generations treated them as false: We sent the She-camel to the Thamud to open their eyes - - -”. Thamud is the only example mentioned here – a tale “borrowed” from old Arab folk tales.
One thing is that we have never been able to understand how a camel could be a proof of Allah. (But actually the camel is part of an old Arab folk tale: It came out from a cliff and became a prophet for a god.) But just read the Bible – which the Quran “borrows” (and twists) many stories from – and you will see that real proof has effect (which is most natural). That it will have no effect just is fast-talk with somewhat bent logic and psychology – one of those any intelligent man knowing something about how people think and reacts was/is sure to know was/is untrue.
· For one thing: To use something which was claimed to have happened, but more than 2ooo years before, is not valid without documentation.
· For another: Muhammad himself used the miracles Moses according to the Quran made and told they made all the sorcerers of Pharaoh Ramses II become Muslims.
· For yet another: There had been several prophets in between - with Jesus as the star in this connection, but also f. ex. Paul - who made miracles people believed in and attracted followers.
This “explanation” is invalid also according to the Quran (contradicted). What is worse: It is one of the places it is clear Muhammad knew he was lying, as it is clear from the Quran that he at least knew about the miracles of both Moses and Jesus, and that these made people believe.
#17/59h. “And We (Allah*) refrains from sending the Signs only because the men of former generations treated them as false- - -“. But there is an interesting remark in Asad’s note and explanation (A 17/71 (to this verse): “His (Muhammad’s*) only miracle was and is the Quran itself”. This is an accepted fact among Muslim scholars and Islamic religious leaders. AND ALL THE SAME THEY CONTINUE AND CONTINUE TO TELL THEIR CONGREGATIONS ABOUT THE (MADE UP) MIRACLES CONNECTED TO MUHAMMAD THAT THE HADITHS TELL ABOUT – AND NOWHERE IN THE HADITH COLLECTIONS DO YOU FIND A WARNING THAT “THE QURAN PROVES THAT THESE MIRACLES ARE MADE UP LEGENDS”. An honest religion? Honest “priests”? Honest professors? (These are among the reasons why it is impossible to rely on Islamic literature – you all the time know you have to check the “facts” before you can use the information (or disinformation or wishful thinking)).
#18/110b: “I (Muhammad*) am but a man like yourselves (Muslims*)…” And among other things “I” thus am unable to perform miracles.
Remember this whenever a Muslim will tell you about some of all the miracles they claim Muhammad performed. That he made no miracles at all, also is very clear from the fact that he had to explain away all requests for such ones - if he had made any miracle, he and his followers had informed about it loudly and often.
For the sake of record we quote the here relevant part of M. Asad’s comment in full ones more, and now directly from English (on Internet): “In many places (not only here in 17/59*) the Quran stresses the fact that the Prophet Muhammad - - - was not empowered to perform miracles similar to those with which the earlier prophets are said to (and in some cases confirmed in the Quran*) have reinforced (NB: Muhammad claimed it would not reinforce his teaching*) their verbal (also Muhammad’s were verbal - only written down afterwards*) messages. His only miracle was and is the Qur’an itself…”. There has never existed one single Muslim scholar who did not know - and knows today - this. ALL THE SAME THEY HAIL MUHAMMAD’S CLAIMED MIRACLES AS PROOFS FOR HIS GOD AND HIS OWN BEING A PROPHET IN SUCH WAYS THAT THE UNEDUCATED MASSES TO A LARGE DEGREE BELIEVE - YES, ARE SURE - THE MIRACLES IS A REALITY. An honest al-Taqiyya (lawful lie). But if the scholars, imams, ayatollahs lie about this to forward the religion, how much more do they lie about?
A small ps:
We had for a long time been aware of Islam’s and Muslims’ disuse of sciences to try to “prove” points in the Quran and in Islam – and concerning Muhammad. But we were too busy to wish to do anything about it.
Then we received a very impolite, slanderous, and haughty mail from a very impolite and haughty Muslim – and a Muslim running one of the typical Islamic internet pages full of invalid logic, unconnected facts, cherry-picking, hopelessly invalid conclusions, etc. (go to www.ExamineTheTruth.com and check for yourself).
That was when we found that enough was enough, and that this was the drop which made the cup spill over. Thus both Muslims and non-Muslims may thank that man(?) and his typical Muslim and partly hopeless page, for this page.
As samples of the level and quality of Islam’s/Muslims’ “proofs” we start with “Examine The Truth”’s claimed “proofs”.
And a small Pps:
The Quran often claims that Allah did or said or claimed this and this, and then one tries finding out if the words and deeds and claims etc. can be true. What often is forgotten is the question: Is it true that it really was Allah who said or did or claimed it? Where in case are the proofs? – for claims are very cheap. (The Quran mainly consists of claims and there exists no real proof for Allah, for Muhammad’s connection to a god, or for Islam at all.)
A) Astronomy: Creation of the Universe.
(Concerning astronomy you will find the Quran’s astronomy – or “astronomy” – described in the chapter about the Quran’s astronomy in “1000+ Mistakes in the Quran” in http://www.1000mistakes.com.)
Aa1. (Claim from “The Way to Truth”).
“It is another argument for the Divine authorship of the Quran that it refers to certain facts of creation recently established by modern scientific methods”. This and similar claims you often meet from Muslims. But there is not one single case where the Quran provably has foretold even one scientific fact. There are lots of claims where quasi-science or twisted claims is tried used like “proofs” for this or that in the Quran, but ask any serious scientist: Not one such one will or can tell you about even a tiny scientific detail in his branch of science which has been foretold by the Quran.
This claim simply is a bluff (though many Muslims have so little education and/or strong wishful thinking, that they honestly believe the claim is true).
“The Way to Truth” here uses this as a sample: “Do not the unbelievers realize that heavens (plural and wrong – there are no 7 material heavens like the Quran claims*) and the earth were one unit of creation before we (Allah*) split them asunder”. But there never was a time when the Earth and the heaven(s?) were one creation, and there never was a time when Earth and the heaven(s?) were split from such a united creation. (Many Muslims without real knowledge of the Big Bang and astronomy claim this refers to the Big Bang. But the reality of the Big Bang and also what happened afterwards are so different from what the Quran vaguely describes, that this is an impossibility. F.x. the Earth did not exist until some 9 billion years after the Big Bang, and thus could not be a unit from which the claimed heavens could split – or the other way around. (And if it had been, it had been utterly destroyed in that explosion). The fact is: Not even the very atoms Earth is made from, existed, except hydrogen, some helium, and perhaps traces of lithium – it simply was physically impossible for Earth to exist at that time. But there on the other hand there is no doubt according to science that a firmament was created within 300ooo – 380ooo years after the Big Bang – though looking very different from “our” one. This means that the firmament – the sky or heaven – is some 13.7 billion or slightly less years old (it is 13.7 billion years since Big Bang). Earth according to science is 4.567 billion years old, and could not “come together with” anything until after it was created (by a god or by nature). This according to the Quran means that when the Universe was 9+ billion years old, Allah ordered it to come together with Earth, and then split it apart. Science has found no kind of indication for that the Universe/heaven and Earth were called together after Earth was made, like the Quran claims, and then split in two – Earth + heaven. (Actually the claim is proved wrong as the radius of the known Universe is much larger than 4.567 billion light years, which was the maximum possible radius if Earth and the heaven/universe had split 4.567 billion years ago.)
Most of the other claims from “The Way to Truth” are so naïve that we do not bother to comment on them – anybody with some brain and a little knowledge will see the hopelessness in the claims. We here repeat: Islam and its Muslims often have problems with the rules for making logically correct conclusions, and they also often seem to be unable to - or do not want to - see the difference between words like “a coincidence”, “possible”, “perhaps”, “probably”, “likely”, etc., etc., and the word “proof”. If they like a point, they use it or twist it and name it “a proof”. But a definition for a proof is: “A proof is one or more proved facts which can give only one conclusion”.
Aa2. (From Mission Islam/The Scientific Miracles of the Quran – short: MI/SMQ).
“He (Allah*) is the originator of the heavens (plural and wrong – but strangely not commented on by MI/SMQ) and the earth”. Such vague claims about creation you find in many religions, included Islam. Many Muslims go one step further: They claim – like normal for Islam and for Muslims without any documentation or other proofs - that this vague sentence proves that Allah made the Big Bang (or more often that the Big Bang proves the Quran and Allah).
But there are so many and so big differences between what scientists know about the Big Bang and about its aftermath, and the description of the creation in the Quran, that this claim is an impossibility. It here is symptomatic that no serious astronomer agrees to these claims from Muslims/Islam.
Two samples: The Quran claims everything originally was smoke – but what exploded in the Big Bang definitely was not smoke, and there never was a time when the universe was smoke (= microscopic particles floating – suspended - in gas (aereosols)) – clouds, fog, etc. are words used by astronomers, but hardly ever smoke. And: The Quran tells that the heavens and Earth once was one unit which Allah split. Muslims here refer to the Big Bang, but for one thing Earth did not exist until 9 billion years later and could not be the one of two parts at the Big Bang, for another; if it had existed, it had been utterly destroyed in that explosion), for a third it is physically impossible that the really distant parts of the universe can have been even near Earth only 4.567 billion years ago, etc.
And to repeat it: The fact is: Not even the very atoms Earth is made from, existed, except hydrogen, some helium, and perhaps traces of lithium – it simply was physically impossible for Earth to exist at that time. But there on the other hand there is no doubt according to science that a firmament was created within 300ooo – 380ooo years after the Big Bang – though looking very different from “our” one. This means that the firmament – the sky or heaven – is some 13.7 billion or slightly less years old (it is 13.7 billion years since Big Bang). Earth according to science is 4.567 billion years old, and could not “come together with” anything until after it was created (by a god or by nature). This according to the Quran means that when the Universe was 9+ billion years old, Allah ordered it to come together with Earth, and then split it apart.
Besides the claim is meaningless as a proof, as none of the underlying facts are proved to be caused by Allah – Islam’s claims here just are built on other not proved claims, presumptions, etc., and remember: Islam and its Muslims in addition often have problems with the rules for making logically correct conclusions, and they also often seem to be unable to - or do not want to - see the difference between words like “a coincidence”, “possible”, “perhaps”, “probably”, “likely”, etc., etc., and the word “proof”. If they like a point, they use it or twist it and name it “a proof”. But a definition for a proof is: “A proof is one or more proved facts which can give only one conclusion”.
Aa3. (From Mission Islam/The Scientific Miracles of the Quran – short: MI/SMQ).
“This fact (the wrong claim that the Big Bang came from nothing and not from a singularity), only recently discovered by modern physics, was announced to us in the Quran 1400 years ago”.
· One serious point here is that the claim is wrong – the Big Bang as mentioned came from a singularity (a mega Black Hole if you want), not from nothing.
· Another is that the Quran never even indicates that creation started with an explosion.
· Yet another is that the Quran’s creation only is about Earth (or really 7 Earths) and its accompanying 7 Heavens (also wrong), stars fastened to the lowermost of the claimed 7 heavens + the sun and the moon. There is nothing about the real universe – yes, the word which in Arab means universe in the real meaning of that word, is not at all even used anywhere in the Quran.
· MI/SMQ’s claim here is wrong, and simply is a bluff based on twisting of some facts and omission of others – and not least of Muslims “ability” to jump quickly from “perhaps a small possibility” to “this is a proof” + “dishonesty is ok ‘if necessary’ to defend or promote Islam”.
The Quran says that once “the heavens (plural and wrong) and the Earth once were joined together - - -, before We (Allah*) clove them asunder - - -” (A. Yusuf Ali 21/30). Muslims claim that this means the Big Bang.
The Big Bang according to science happened 13.7 billion years ago. A so-called singularity – a really enormous mass of crushed matter concentrated by gravity into a point - exploded. This explosion resulted in a rapidly expanding and cooling cloud consisting mainly of hydrogen plus some helium and likely some traces of lithium – nothing else. This all existed only as atoms, and in the form of ions – charged atoms. (And f.x. no smoke.)
This hot cloud of ions is what Muslims claim were the 7 heavens (plural and wrong in the Quran) and the Earth which then were split apart. But for one thing the gas – and there only was gas – did not split apart, and for another there existed no Earth and no material heavens (the Quran indirectly, but very clearly states that the 7 heavens are material ones – if not f.x. the stars could not be fastened to the lowermost one (below the moon)) which could be cleft apart.
To be exact on that point: Not even the atoms which now make up the Earth did exist, with the exception of hydrogen, some helium, and perhaps traces of lithium. The claim that the Big Bang is what is told about in the Quran, is an al-Taqiyya – a lawful lie.
And to shortly take the story further: During the next some 300ooo years the first stars/suns condensed from that gas, and started to create heavier atoms – up to and included iron – and then after some millions of years many of them started to go super-nova. In the super-nova explosions heavier matter was created and spread into the interstellar space – where it became a small part of the next generation stars, which repeated the process and spread some more of heavier matter into interstellar and –galactic space. Our sun, Helios, is a 3. generation star and contains a (minor) percentage of such matter. For some reason heavy matter was concentrated in planets like Mercury, Venus, Earth (Tellus), and Mars. They – and the sun – were made some 4.567 billion years ago = more than 9 billion years after the Big Bang. Thus there f.x. existed no Earth which could be cleft from the claimed 7 (material) heavens at the time of Big Bang. As for time, the claim is more than 9 billion years wrong. As for physics neither a material Earth nor material 7 heavens which could be cleft in the 2 parts (Earth + the heavens) did exist – and not least: Not even the material which 9+ billion years later came to make up Earth existed – only ionized gas (at those temperatures also lithium was a gas – if it existed).
This is what Muslims claim proves that when the Quran claims that the material Earth and the material 7 heavens were cleft in (2) parts – Earth and the 7 heavens – this “proves” the Quran.
To make the joke complete for one thing they in this connection never mention the fact that the Quran indirectly, but clearly states that everything consists only of Earth and the 7 heavens + the lights (sun, moon, stars) which are parts of or between the heavens, except the stars which hang under the lowest heaven, and for another they when talking about that the Big Bang proves the cleaving in parts in the Quran, they NEVER mention the fact that the Quran states that before the Earth and the heavens were split in 2 (or perhaps in 8 as the Quran claims there are 7 heavens), everything was smoke (remember that gas and smoke are two fundamentally very different things – free atoms moving freely around vs. microscopic particles normally from oxygenation/burning of matter floating in gas), which Allah first ordered to come together before he split it in 2 or 8 parts. This smoke – which never existed neither in the old nor in today’s universe. Scientists hardly even use the word “smoke” when describing relevant phenomenon in the universe – “gas” and “clouds”, yes, but hardly ever “smoke”. This “coming together” of the smoke to form one body like the Quran claims, is not part of the Big Bang, and thus Muslims and Islam “forget” to mention it. This is very normal for Muslim miracle hunters: They cherry-pick and if necessary twist points they like, but “forget” points which make their “conclusions” impossible. The coming-together of the claimed smoke before the cleaving, is one of the many points which makes it impossible to explain this part of the Quran with the Big Bang.
This way of argument is very typical for Muslims and for Islam; one cherry-pick words and expressions and facts, adjust them for the Quran or adjust the texts in the Quran – like here by “forgetting” the parts of the texts which does not fit the story and the conclusions they want – and get the “answers” or “proofs” they want.
It is further typical for Muslims and Islam that they do not look for “what is true and what cannot be true”, but only for “the Quran is true – how can we by honest or dishonest means “prove” it is the truth?”
And not least it is very typical for Muslims and Islam that they seem not to know the difference between words like “may be”, “an indication”, “perhaps”, “a chance for”, “likely”, “probably”, etc., etc., and the word “proof”. Every time they find an answer they like – true or “adjusted” or made up – it all too often and quickly is claimed to be a proof. With a lot of good will one could say that the Big Bang was a slight indication for that Allah in a twisted way – stronger is not possible to express it from the deductions possible to make from the known facts – knew what he was talking about. But Muslims/Islam gallantly omits the texts in the Quran which does not fit, overlook lots of scientific facts which make the claim impossible, and claim: “This prove the Quran!!”
All too many Muslim “proofs” are of this quality.
Muslims and Islam will have to prove their never documented claim that Muhammad meant the Big Bang when he claimed the heaven and Earth once – at least 9 billion years after the Big Bang for Earth to exist – was called together by a god, and made into one mass before it was split in two, the heaven and the Earth. Science never has found any trace of such a getting-together, neither any trace of such a splitting after Earth came into existence.
It is very – not to say extremely – normal for miracle scholars and miracle hunters in Islam never first to prove that what they claim Muhammad meant or was talking about, really was what the claim he meant or was talking about. No proof” where this is not first proved (“a proof is one or more proved facts - - -“), is a valid one, but only a claim.
Aa4. (From Mission Islam/The Scientific Miracles of the Quran – short: MI/SMQ).
“And it is We (Allah*) who constructed the heaven with might, and verily, it is We who are steadily expanding it”. This is how MI/SMQ recites 51/47.
M. Yusuf Ali translates it like this: “With power and skill did We (Allah*) construct the Firmament: For it is We who created the vastness of Space”. M.H. Shakir says: “And the Heaven, We (Allah*) raised it high with power, and most surely We are the makers of things ample”. (M. Yusuf Ali and Shakir are reckoned to be two of the 3 best translators ever of the Quran to English (no. 3 is Picthal) – M. Yusuf Ali perhaps the very best).
Not one word about an expanding universe (on top of this the Arab word meaning “universe” in the modern meaning of that word, is not at all used in the entire Quran), not to mention about a constantly expanding one (wrong – the expansion is not constant, but accelerating). “Twist words and facts and perhaps the texts of the Quran, and you find “proofs” for the Quran” .
Islam is the only one of the big religions which not only accepts, but advices, the use of dishonesty “if necessary” to defend or promote the religion (al-Taqiyya – the lawful lie, Kitman – the lawful half-truth, Hilah – the lawful circumventing/pretending, the use of deceit, even the use of broken words/promises/oaths (2/225, 5/89, 16/91, 66/2)).
There also is the question of coincidences which Muslims and Islam always deny. There are billions of facts in the world and Muhammad said thousands of things. The laws of chance dictates that if you pair all this together there have got to be things which fit together – or by some twisting may seemingly fit together - - - by sheer chance. (And it here may be significant that Muhammad had fewer such “hits” than the law of probability would indicate he should have had – he was intelligent and sly, but not very imaginative.)
No further comment should be necessary.
Aa5. (From Mission Islam/The Scientific Miracles of the Quran – short: MI/SMQ).
“- - - the heavens (plural and wrong*) and the earth were joined together (as one unit of creation), before We (Allah*) clove them asunder.” Muslims try to make much out of the Big Bang, and by using the “correct” words, many with limited knowledge about the Big Bang – or about the Quran – believe the fancy claims they are told.
· There is not one indication in the entire Quran for that Allah was involved in the Big Bang or even for that Allah created the beginning by means of an explosion.
· There is no indication in the Quran for that the Big Bang here was meant by Muhammad. Without such a proof, any “proofs” based on the Big Bang are invalid – “a proof is one or more proved facts - - -“.
· The Quran never mentions one single astronomical object outside our planetary system, except the stars, and the stars according to that book is fastened to the lowest of the 7 heavens below our moon. (You find a full overview over the Quran’s astronomy in http://1000mistakes.com, Book A.)
· Earth did not exist until some 9 billion years after the Big Bang, and could not be “a unit of creation” when the Big Bang happened – and if it had been, it had been utterly destroyed.
· These all are facts educated Muslim scholars know – they are elementary facts. This means that when Muslim scholars say and write what they all too often do, they know their claims are built on twisted facts or even pure dishonesty. But then Islam is the only one of the big religions which not only accepts, but promotes, the use of dishonesty “if necessary” to defend or promote the religion.
Aa6. (From Mission Islam/The Scientific Miracles of the Quran – short: MI/SMQ).
“- - - when we see the first moment of the Big Bang, we see that a single point included all the matter in the universe”.
If you sift through all the billions of facts which exists on the Earth and compare them with all the texts of the Quran, you are bound to find points which by sheer coincidence may look alike, at least if you in addition twist and cherry-pick words and facts to get not the truth, but the answers you want. Your audience may even believe your findings if they lack education and knowledge.
· There is not one word in the Quran tying Allah to the Big Bang.
· There is not one word in the Quran indicating that Allah created the world in an explosion.
· There is not one word in the Quran of any astronomical object outside our planetary system, except the stars, and they are fastened to the lowest of the claimed 7 heavens – under our moon.
· Judging from the speed and direction of distant stars, the Big Bang took place far outside our solar system (though where is impossible to say).
· The Quran according to M. Yusuf Ali says (21/30) that the heavens (plural and wrong) and the Earth were cloven asunder – not “separated” like MI/MSQ says. Then the Quran cannot mean the Big Bang, because a mixture of free ions or even smaller particles cannot be cloven asunder. Shakir even says: “- - - the heavens (plural and wrong*) and the earth were closed up, but We (Allah*) have opened them - - -“. Absolutely no connection or relevance to Big Bang.
· There also is the time factor: The Big Bang took place some 13.7 billion years ago, whereas Earth took shape some 4.567 billion years ago = some 9+ billion years later. Earth did not exist as something which someone could clove away from something – or opened – 9+ billion years before it came into existence.
· The strongest word Islam can use for Allah’s connection to Big Bang is “a theoretical possibility”. But there is a long dishonesty from “a theoretical possibility” to claiming the Big Bang as a proof – especially as the Quran’s claims about astronomy, etc. are laughingly different from scientific astronomical knowledge, and thus prove that things are very wrong in those Islamic claims.
Aa7. (From Mission Islam/The Scientific Miracles of the Quran – short: MI/SMQ).
“We (Allah*) made the sky a preserved and protected roof…” (21/32). But Shakir says, “And We made the heaven a guarded canopy…”, and A. Yusuf Ali: “And We (Allah*) made the heavens as a canopy well guarded..).
What the Quran tells according to Yusuf Ali and Shakir, is that Allah made the claimed 7 well guarded heavens a roof over the Earth. But knowing there is no such roof up there, MI/SMQ may have changed the translation a little to make it sound like the air is a roof. But there is no roof – we are living in an open air theatre.
But of course: As the Quran says the heavens are a roof – or canopy – when it is proved that this is wrong, one should try to find other ways of making the book sound correct - - - because if it is not correct in all details, the Quran is not from a god, and the Islam is a made up religion.
The sorry fact is that for believing Muslims the thing is not to find out what is the truth, but to make the Quran look true – with honest or dishonest means (f.x. al-Taqiyya, Kitman. Hilah, etc.).
And not to forget: It is nowhere proved that Allah is involved with anything , and thus no matter what claims, they only are claims: “A proof is one or more proved facts which can give only one conclusion”. (Also many of the Muslim claims have more than one possible conclusion, and also for that reason are invalid as proofs.)
Aa8. (From “Evidence that Islam is True” – EIT, www.freewebs.com/proofofislam).
EIT claims that “the Big Crunch” is proved by the miraculous prophesy in 21/104: “That day (of Doom*) We (Allah*) will fold up heaven like folding up the pages of a book”. “The Big Crunch” is an expression from outdated science – one believed that because of gravity the expansion of the Universe would stop, and then everything would fall into each other in a giant implosion. One thing is that an implosion is something very different from folding up a book. Worse: Some years ago science found out that the expansion is not decelerating, but accelerating. This means there never will be a Big Crunch.
Aa9. (From “Evidence that Islam is True” – EIT).
“Then He (Allah*) turned to Heaven when it was smoke - - -“. The Universe never was smoke (smoke as mentioned is microscopic particles of matter – normally from oxygenation/burning - floating in gas). Muslims here normally indicate the time just after the Big Bang, but by then everything was gas and nothing smoke. But see Aa.10 just below.
Aa10. (From “Evidence that Islam is True” – EIT).
“’Come (together*) willing or unwilling’. They (the smoke*) said: ‘We come willingly’”. This according to the Quran is the scene just before Allah made the smoke hard matter and clove Earth from the 7 heavens. Here EIT chooses it to mean the situation in space billions of years later, when stars and perhaps planets are made in some of the big clouds – nebulae – in space. But for one thing he/she never proves that it is Allah who creates the new stars (“a proof is one or more proved facts - - -“), for another he/she never proves that this was what Muhammad was talking about (and without such a proof this just a claim, not a proof) and for a third he is silent about a main fact: The Quran tells it was smoke, whereas science tells that it was gas clouds or dust clouds. But dust is not smoke – just like a dust storm in Sahara is not smoke.
Like so often in Islam: Twist your facts a little to get the answers you like. The main thing is not to find the truth, but – right or wrong and with honest or dishonest means (al-Taqiyya, Kitman, Hilah, etc.) – to “prove” that the Quran is right. Miracle scholars at work, or miracle hunters?
Aa11. (From “Evidence that Islam is True” – EIT, www.freewebs.com/proofofislam).
“For it is We (Allah*) Who created the vastness of Space” (51/47). EIT uses this as another argument for Aa9 and Aa10 above. But note that he here uses A. Yusuf Ali’s translation. In Ab11 he uses a translation of the same point telling that 51/47 here says that it is Allah who expands the universe.
Cherry-picking to the second power.
“Choose the dishonesty you need to get the answer you want”.
Aa12. (From Islamguiden – IG).
“To describe initial celestial matter, the word “smoke” is more appropriate than gas”. At least for IG, but a dishonesty, as gas and smoke definitely are two very different things (“gas” is free atoms or molecules moving freely around, whereas “smoke” is aerosols – miniscule particles – from burnt (normally oxygenated) material floating in gas). As science talks about ionized hydrogen, some ionized helium and perhaps traces of lithium, whereas the Quran talks about smoke, it definitely is more convenient for IG wrongly to call gas “smoke”. It is one of the many verbal tricks you meet from Islam and it’s Muslim. Also remember that this situation took place from 13.7 billions of years ago, and a few million years on. Earth was created 4.567 billion years ago = 9+ billion years after the Big Bang. If Allah thus called Earth and the heaven together, it happened at least 9 billion years after the Big Bang – and long time after the time of dense, ionized gas was over. Science also has found no traces of such a get-together, and of no dividing after Earth was made.
There are several reasons for that the Big Bang cannot have been the splitting of the Earth from the heaven – f.x. that not even the atoms making up Earth existed, and that if Earth had existed, it had been blown to atoms again in that explosion – in addition to this one. Islam is using its magic of similarity like so often: Big Bang exploded the mass – which may be claimed to be a splitting. The Quran claims Earth and heaven were split in two – and as one after a fashion can use the same word, “split”, in both cases, and not to forget that the Big Bang meant expansion and the Quran mentions that Allah expanded his heaven, Islamic logic – which is far from normal logic in many religious cases – tells: Similarity magic tells that as both are “split” and expanding, they must be the same – not “may be the same”, but “is the same”. - some logic. (But it is the same shining logic they use when they claim that the angel Gabriel = the Holy Spirit: Gabriel was claimed to bring Muhammad texts, but a few times also the Holy Spirit was claimed to have brought him texts. The nice similarity magic then tells that Gabriel = the Holy Spirit, because both were claimed to bring him texts. Once more: Some logic!!)
When you start with wrong facts, you get a wrong result. But for many Muslims that does not matter, as long as the wrong result may indicate that the Quran is right. “Right or wrong – my religion”.
Aa13. (From “wireclub “/topix/religion”).
“Do not the Unbelievers (non-Muslims*) see that the heavens (plural and wrong – there are no 7 heavens above Earth*) and earth were joined together (as one unit of creation), before We (Allah*) clove them asunder”. This one here – and MANY other Muslims claims - are “proved” by the Big Bang; it contains “one unit”, “smoke”, “cleaving”, just like in the Quran. The Muslim “law”; “similarity magic = Proof”, is quickly at work.
But it is wrong – f.x. the time sequences are utterly incompatible, and the same with other facts. In the Quran there first is smoke which condenses into heavens and the Earth. Then Allah orders them together before he cleaves Earth away from the heavens.
In reality there first was a singularity (compare it to a hyper-massive Black Hole) and then an enormous explosion – not a cleaving, but an explosion. Then there were dense gas clouds – mainly hydrogen, but some helium and perhaps a little lithium, and at these temperatures (millions or billions of degrees) all of it was in the form of ionized gas. Not smoke, but gas – smoke and gas are fundamentally different. Gas and smoke are not interchangeable things, like many Muslims like to claim to be able to twist the Big Bang enough to make it fit the Quran.
This period of ionized gas lasted for perhaps 300ooo – 380ooo years. During that time many stars were made in the gas clouds. Many of them were super-big stars because of all the dense gas they could “eat”. Super-big stars have a short life, before they explode as super-novas. During their life they produce light and medium matter from mainly hydrogen, and when they explode, they make heavy matter during the explosion – and spread all kinds of matter it has produced into the void. Matter of the kinds which make up f.x. Earth started to accumulate in the Universe, but slowly. It took billions of years of star forming/super nova explosions to generate enough. Our sun and Earth are 3. generation stars/planets. As the Universe is some 13.7 billion years old, and sun/Earth only 4.567 billion years, this means it took 9+ billion years for sun/Earth to be made.
The cycles thus are:
· Big explosion - not cleaving, but explosion.
· Gas, slowly making stars.
· 2-3 cycles of stars/supernova – 9+ billion years.
· Sun and Earth are made (ca. 4.567 bill. years ago).
· The smoke condenses (ordered by Allah).
· Heaven and Earth are one unit.
· Earth is cleft away from the heavens.
Reality starts with an explosion – not with a condensation followed by a cleaving in 2 (the word used in the Arab Quran is “fataq”, which means to disunite or separate), but an explosion. The Quran starts with smoke – the Big Bang never produced smoke (astronomers hardly uses that word – gas, yes, clouds, yes, smoke, no). Already here we meet the problems: Big Bang was one unit, and then became gas. The Quran first has smoke, and then one unit. Also the timing is wrong compared to reality.
Reality continues to expand and to make new stars. The Quran tells about a coming-together of the heavens (of necessity including the stars, as according to the Quran the stars are fastened to the lowest of the claimed 7 heavens, below the moon. More wrong timing + that science never has found traces from a coming-together of the stars after the Big Bang, not to mention one including Earth. To include Earth also the order from Allah to get together would have had to wait for 9+ billion years until the Earth was made.
Science has never found traces from a coming-together of the claimed smoke/heavens and Earth 9+ billion years after the Big Bang, nor from the cleaving apart of Earth from the heavens, like the Quran claims.
As for the claim that the Big Bang is identical with the cleaving away of the Earth, like the Quran claims, this is impossible also for two other reasons: Such an enormous explosion had reduced Earth to atoms again, and even if that had not happened, the temperature the first thousands of years after the Bang, had vaporized Earth in a short time.
Both the time sequences, and the differences in what things happened, and the other facts make it impossible to explain the Quran’s story of creation with what reality tells.
Except by the famous Muslim “similarity magic” or “twisted similarity magic”.
Muslims claims here simply are wrong and impossible and incompatible with the Big Bang – except for for people knowing little about the Big Bang and/or the “twisted similarity magic” of Muslims/Islam.
Aa14**. (From “Quran.org” - Qo).
“The Koran (another way of writing Quran*) talks about an “expanding” Universe centuries before scientists described it: ‘And the sky We /Allah*) built with might, and we caused the expansion of it”.
Muhammad claimed Earth and the 7 (non-existing) material heavens were split (fataq in Arab) into two parts – Earth and the heavens. He then expanded this mini-universe to the size Muhammad believed it occupied when Allah had completed his creation of it. When the creation was completed and the expansion finished, Allah placed the heavens on “pillars you do not see” – invisible pillars – raising up from Earth, and the heavens he placed resting on these (not existing) pillars, according to the Quran.
Thus the “fact” that the heavens are resting on pillars according to the Quran, proves – proves – that the Quran’s universe is a static one, not a continuously expanding one. Allah only expanded his mini-universe to its “present size” and then stopped his work, as it was completed (Creation always is told about in the past tense in the Quran, never in present or future – it is a finished job.)
Qo here has cherry-picked the single word “expanding” and used it “in absurdum”. The fact that another “fact” stated in the Quran makes their claim impossible is “forgotten” even though any knower of the Quran knows that according to that book the (non-existing, but claimed) 7 heavens are resting on pillars on Earth, and thus that further expansion was and is impossible. The “universe” in the Quran is a static, not an expanding one – the expansion finished and the “universe” static and complete.
This is a very much used technique by miracle scholars and other miracle hunters in Islam: They cherry-pick a word or an expression or a fact (or “fact” – f.x. twisting of scientific facts or knowledge), And “voila!!” here is a “proof” for the Quran!! This in spite of that the full facts of around the case may make the “proof” impossible, and in many cases – like here – even the Quran itself makes the “proof” impossible, because even other “information” in the book makes the claimed conclusion impossible.
In very many cases the misused science or other facts are elementary ones or ones easy to check if are true. There therefore is no doubt that many or most educated Muslims – scholars – know or easily can check that the claim(s) is/are wrong. This is even more clear when “miracle scholars” cherry pick/disuse texts from the Quran.
· There f.x. does not exist one single Muslim scholar on this wide Earth who does not know that the Quran tells that the heavens rest on pillars on Earth, and no heaven resting on something can be moving, not to mention expanding.
· There also does not exist one single Muslim scholar who does not know that according to the Quran, the moon is a light in the midst of the 7 heavens (71/16) = something like 3 of the heavens must be below the moon, and that this in any case is the situation for the lowest heaven. There also does not exist one single Muslim scholar who does not know that according to the Quran the stars are fastened to the lowest heaven. And stars fixed in a position below the moon are not and cannot be parts of an expanding universe.
· To complete the picture, the Quran also one place tells that the planets are receding = moving away. But any astronomer will tell you that the planets have stayed in their fixed orbits for billions of year. Thus in the Quran the planets, which are staying put in their fixed orbits are moving away according to the Quran, whereas the stars , many of which are moving away from us, stay put – fixed to the lowest heaven below the moon, also this according to the Quran. In both cases the Quran tells exactly the opposite of what is the reality.
That Muslim “miracle scholars” are able to cherry pick one interesting word – here “expanding” – dismiss everything in the Quran which make their wishful claims impossible, and proudly claim that this and this “proves” the Quran, tells a lot about them and about their ways of handling truths and lies.
Worse: The fact that each and every Muslim scholar and each and every Muslim clergy from mullah and imam and up, know the real and complete Quranic texts and know that the claims in reality are killed and made impossible by other verses in the book – like here – and all the same they – not one of them - do not step forward and say: “Stop! This cannot be a true proof, because the Quran also says this and this!” This dishonesty – really al-Taqiyyas (lawful lies) - tells lots and lots about the Muslims scholars. Not about one or a few of them, but about all of them. And not least it tells a lot about Islam.
But how much is a religion accepting and partly relying on the use of dishonesty worth? And how much of the religion is truth and how much is made up claims? Who except blind believers can trust and rely on such a religion?
And how many of their proofs are valid anything at all? (The reality is that there does not exist one valid proof neither for Allah, nor for Muhammad’s connection to a god, nor for the truth of the Quran. This is the real reason behind making up all these “proofs” for the Quran).
A religion based only on the words of a man of very doubtful moral – perhaps even with a mental disease (TLE – Temporal Lobe Epilepsy) and perhaps in addition psychopathic – but with a strong wish for power and for riches for bribes and for women. And a religion accepting and actively using dishonesty as a working tool.
But many of these made up “proofs” works. Many not too educated persons and many wishful thinkers believe in them. And according to Muhammad and Islam when it comes to defending or spreading Islam, you should use also dishonesty “if necessary” or if this gives a better result. Muhammad himself f.x. says that he would break even an oath if that would give a better result, and he practiced deceit, and what Muhammad did, every Muslim can or should do unless it is directly forbidden them.
“The Religion of Truth!” (!!!)
Aa15. (From “Quran.org” - Qo).
“The Koran mentions that at a stage in its origin, the universe was “gaseous”: “And also, turned He (Allah*) to the sky when it was as smoke” (Koran 41/11)”.
Here is a nice little “textbook” in “miracle scholars’” way of working: The original Arab text talks about “the sky (not the universe, but the sky) when it was smoke”. Abdulla Yusuf Ali took one careful step towards the correct fact that it never was smoke, but once gas, by changing the text a little: “- - - when it was (as) smoke”. Qo brazenly takes one more step: “- - - when it was as smoke”. And then he/she argues from the claim that this means “when it was ‘gaseous’ - - - “, and then happily goes on arguing like if the Quran had said “gas”.
Islam claims that it is “The Religion of Peace” (overlooking the main messages about this in the surahs from Medina) and “The Religion of Truth” (overlooking all the mistakes, etc. and some lies in the Quran), but normally not even Islam claims that it is “The Religion of Honesty”.
But gas and smoke are two very different things. Gas is free atoms moving freely around. Smoke is microscopic particles floating in gas (aerosols) – normally particles produced by oxygenation (burning) of some matter. For a comparison: Water and oil both are fluids, but oil definitely is not water.
This claim about that Muhammad’s smoke is proved by science’s words about gas after the Big Bang (9+ billion years before Earth even existed), you frequently meet from Muslims. But only the fact that gas and smoke are very different things – at least as different as water and oil - makes the “miracle scholars’” claim here invalid and thus the claimed “proof” invalid. To be believed they have first to prove that gas = smoke. They also will have to prove that gas really was what the clumsy Allah meant when he in his dysfunctional brain formed the word “smoke”, hoping that the clever humans should help him by explaining what he “really” meant - - - in spite of that the Quran tells its texts are clear and easy , explained by Allah and to be understood literally.
We remind you that Islam is the only one of the big religions which has rules for permitted use of dishonesty, and the only one which advises that dishonesty should be used “if necessary” when defending or promoting the religion.
Aa16. (From “Quran.org” - Qo).
“’I swear by the sky and (the phenomena of) Tariq, And what will explain to you Tariq is? It is a star that pierces (or makes a hole)’ (86/1-3). Qo claims that the Arab word “at-Tariq” “literally signifies a puncture or a minute hole”. And he/she concludes that this proves that Muhammad was speaking about Black Holes/singularities – which means divine knowledge. And this he/she claims is a proof for that the Quran is from Allah.
First the claim: For one thing there is nothing in Qo’s text which indicates that Muhammad talked about a Black Hole/singularity – he/she and those of Islam who say the same or similar (there are quite a number) will have to prove this before one even can think about the text as an indication – not to mention a proof - for Qo’s claim. Also remember that a Black Hole is not really a hole, but a place in space where large masses of matter is concentrated in practically just a point, and because of this with extreme gravity. The “hole” is just a metaphor or picture to visualize the situation – it is not really a hole (and the correct name for it is “a singularity”). Thus Qo’s claim about a star piercing a hole is hopeless also for physical reasons.
More serious is this: Top translators – f.x. Yusuf Ali and Shakir – says that “at-Tariq” means not “a puncture or a minute hole”, but “The Night-Visitant”, “The Night-Comer”, or “What comes at Night”, to quote 3 of them. (And none of them would make up anything just here, because “At-Tariq” is the official name of Surah 86 – too holy to be falsified.) To quote Yusuf Ali a correct translation is: “By the Sky and the Night-Visitant (therein) – And what will explain to thee what the Night-Visitant is? It is the star of piercing brightness - - -“. That this is the normal Islamic translation is documented from the fact that other top translators have very similar translations, and of the fact that Islam for 1400 years has debated what star is meant – but a star and nothing fancier. Many meant and mean that it must be the morning star, whereas heavy Islamic “guns” like Zamakhshari and Raghib said it must mean “the star” in the generic meaning of the word – still a star and nothing else. There never in all the history of Islam was a hint about that Muhammad meant anything but an ordinary, though strongly shining star. (Like the name says a Black Hole is black and not shining – though there can come light from outside its “event horizon” (the sphere describing the point of no return around a singularity – also called a Black Hole) from matter about to fall into the singularity (which is the correct name for it), but that is not from the “hole”, and that area – outside the “event horizon” - definitely is not a small area or point able to pierce anything. It may be thousands and much more miles across.)
An extra piece of irony is that in spite of the name, science does not describe a Black Hole as a hole in their picture/metaphor, but as a deep well. The correct name is not even a Black Hole but a singularity. Not even in their metaphor scientists talk about a hole but about a deep well. Just look at the illustrations they use, and you will see this is correct. Where is the “puncture” Qo claims proves the Quran according to their twisted Quranic text? “Miracle hunters” at work – and most people do not know enough about Black Holes/singularities, and many because of this believe in the incorrect and invalid “proof”.
But where is the “miracle hunters’/scholars’” honesty?
As for “gates to the sky”, it is not correct that the Quran uses the terminology of Black Holes/singularities in relation to “gates to the sky”. This claim also is irrelevant, because even though there is speculation in science not about gates to the sky, but of “wormholes” – shortcuts through space. But at present “wormholes” just is speculation on the level of science fiction, and has no value for proving anything at all, neither in science nor in any religion.
What has happened here is that Qo either has used a twisted translation or twisted the text of the Quran “a little” to make up a point which – fleeing from physical facts – can be further twisted into a “proof” for the Quran. There are far too many such “proofs” circulating (many uneducated people or wishful thinkers even believe in them). This tells a lot about the “miracle scholars”/“miracle hunters” who make up these “proofs”. But it tells a by far more sinister story about Islamic clergy, Islamic religious leaders, Islamic scholars, and not least about Islam who accepts the use of such “proofs” without any protests or comments – some of them even use them themselves.
And not least does the use of made up “proofs” prove the fact that Islam has no proofs for any of their central religious claims - if they had, there was no reason to resort to dishonest, made up “proofs”.
How reliable is a religion relying on dishonesty to promote itself? And how much of the religion is earlier made up stories and dishonesty? The questions are extra relevant as the religion only is built on a book far too full of errors and worse – and at least a few lies – to come from any god?
Honesty is not always the main thing for Muslims defending or promoting Islam, as you perhaps know.
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This work was upload with assistance of M. A. Khan, editor of islam-watch.org and the author of "Islamic Jihad: A Legacy of Forced Conversion, Imperialism, and Slavery".